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Messages from 103000

Article: 103000
Subject: System Generator Eval version for Malab R2006a
From: "Kishore" <kishore2k4@gmail.com>
Date: 24 May 2006 07:40:10 -0700
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
Hi,

      I know this is the not the exact place to talk about system
generator but I felt that this is the closest one. I have access to a
system that has Matlab R2006a on it. I wanted to try system generator
evaluation version but it just won't install as only 8.1.1i supports it
and that is only available for purchase. Is there any alterantive to
make System Generator 8.1i work with Matlab R2006a or do I have to wait
till that service pack is available for evaluation too?

cheers,
kishore.


Article: 103001
Subject: Re: ISE 8.1SP4 PN doesnt start
From: "Tim" <tim@rockylogiccom.noooospam.com>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 15:54:56 +0100
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>

Ben Jones wrote

> The veritable deluge of complaints - both from customers and from internal
> users - has not simply leaked away into the Water Table of Inaction: 
> rather,
> it has been funneled through the Downpipe of Customer Support and 
> collected
> in the Water Butt of the Change Request System. Some of it is currently
> leaking through the Damp-Proof Course of Management. Erm, stop me when
> I've taken the analogy too far... :)

Quoting a England football manager:
"I don't believe in metaphor. I believe in calling a spade a spade."



Article: 103002
Subject: Re: Signal 2 clocks long but only one clock possible
From: "Dennis" <dennis.binder@gmx.de>
Date: 24 May 2006 07:57:23 -0700
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
Thank you for your advice.
I'm running a new long time test with
a glitch-free frame_rdy_out.


Dennis


Article: 103003
Subject: Re: fpga debug
From: Vivian Bessler <vivian.bessler.nospam@sandbyte.com>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 16:40:34 +0100
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
Marco,
If you have access to a tool such as ChipScope (embedded Logic analyzer 
from Xilinx http://www.xilinx.com/ise/optional_prod/cspro.htm ) this 
will provide a more convenient debug solution.  However the picoblaze 
approach is definitely more fun.

Vivian
--
Sandbyte

> Falk,
> really interesting your idea of using a Picoblaze as a terminal server,
> I have to deal with a Spartan3, could you please give more details on
> the way you do that?
> Thanks,
> Marco
> 

Article: 103004
Subject: Re: FPGA : P&R problem - Help !
From: Andy Ray <andrewray@blueyonder.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 15:49:47 GMT
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
bijoy wrote:
> Hi I am facing the following problem during P&R of my design
> 
> =================================== Error - Description Phase 1.1 ERROR:Place:341 - The design contains 3 Block RAM components that are configured as 512x36 Block RAMs and 11 Multiplier components. The Multiplier site adjacent to the location of a 512x36 Block RAM component must remain free because of resource sharing. Therefore a device must have at least 14 Multiplier sites for this design to fit. The current device has only 12 Multiplier sites.
> 
> ===================================
> 
> I am using FFT core with 18-bit as the input data width, then all these above errors pops up if i reduce the input width to 17-bit, the design won't give any error.
> 
> can any body help me to sort this problem ??
> 
> Thanks in advance
> 
> Bijoy



I believe someone mentioned recently that you cant use a block ram and 
it's adjacent multiplier at the same time if the block ram is configured 
in 36 bit mode.

A possible solution, which may or may not work, would be to build each 
512x36 RAM you require out of two RAM's configured as 1024x18.

Cheers,

Andy.

Article: 103005
Subject: Re: fpga debug
From: "Nial Stewart" <nial@nialstewartdevelopments.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 18:00:16 +0100
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
"Marco" <marco@marylon.com> wrote in message 
news:1148475677.352442.62550@y43g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> Hi,
> how does debug work in with fpga?
> On common processor you can move from line to line of code, check
> variables values and have the whole system control with the jtag.
> How do things change here?
> Thanks,
> Marco


Most functional debug is done with a simulator.

The techniques Falk has outlined are useful for debugging real world interface
problems but for debugging the majoroty of typos, logical errors etc then
you need a simulator.

Simulation can range from a quick and dirty simple module level
testbench to a full system tests modelling the behaviour of external
RAMS, PCI interfaces etc.



Nial.



Article: 103006
Subject: Stopping Quartus using multipliers?
From: "Nial Stewart" <nial@nialstewartdevelopments.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 18:15:28 +0100
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
I'm prototyping a design on an Altera NIOS evaluation board with
an EP2C35. The design will eventually be targeted at a much smaller
device, possibly an EP2C5.

I have a couple of FIR filters that I want implemented in the FPGA
fabric rather than in the dedicated multipliers so I can guage the
footprint/performance. Quartus keeps using the multipliers and
I can't work out how to stop it.

Can anyone help?



Nial



----------------------------------------------------------
Nial Stewart Developments Ltd        Tel: +44 131 561 6291
42/2 Hardengreen Business Park       Fax: +44 131 561 6327
Dalkeith, Midlothian
EH22 3NU
www.nialstewartdevelopments.co.uk





Article: 103007
Subject: Re: Stopping Quartus using multipliers?
From: Mike Treseler <mike_treseler@comcast.net>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 10:40:23 -0700
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
Nial Stewart wrote:

> I have a couple of FIR filters that I want implemented in the FPGA
> fabric rather than in the dedicated multipliers so I can guage the
> footprint/performance. Quartus keeps using the multipliers and
> I can't work out how to stop it.

Could you code something that uses up all the multipliers?

     -- Mike Treseler

Article: 103008
Subject: setting max fanout with xps flow
From: Matt Blanton <notreally@myemail.com>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 13:45:13 -0400
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
I want to constrain the max fanout for a particular net in my design. I am
using the XPS flow and the net I want to constrain is a BRAM address signal
and is generate by xps, during platgen I suppose.  I don't think I can just
go in and add attribute constraints to the system.vhd file in the hdl/
directory because those files seem to be regenerate every time. How can I
constrain the fanout for this net? Thanks for any pointers.

Matt

Article: 103009
Subject: Re: I2C on Xilinx V4
From: Ray Andraka <ray@andraka.com>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 13:46:37 -0400
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>

The I2C interface is pretty simple for just talking to a slave.  I 
personally find it much easier to just infer a shift register and small 
state machine rather than putting in pico or microblaze and all the 
baggage that goes with it.

Article: 103010
Subject: Re: FPGA : P&R problem - Help !
From: "Symon" <symon_brewer@hotmail.com>
Date: 24 May 2006 19:57:54 +0200
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
"Andy Ray" <andrewray@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message 
news:vg%cg.202900$tc.171588@fe2.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
>
>
> I believe someone mentioned recently that you cant use a block ram and 
> it's adjacent multiplier at the same time if the block ram is configured 
> in 36 bit mode.
>
> A possible solution, which may or may not work, would be to build each 
> 512x36 RAM you require out of two RAM's configured as 1024x18.
>
> Cheers,
>
Hi Andy,
Yeah, that might work. Make the 512*36 a 1024*36 made from 2 off 1024*18. 
Then it should fit, as you've still only used 6 BlockRAMs.
Cheers, Syms. 



Inviato da X-Privat.Org - Registrazione gratuita http://www.x-privat.org/join.php

Article: 103011
Subject: Re: I2C on Xilinx V4
From: "Antti" <Antti.Lukats@xilant.com>
Date: 24 May 2006 11:11:57 -0700
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
it depends, :) microblaze is true overkill, but picoblaze isnt,
specially if you have some other minor managements taks to take also,
then it really pays the fpga resource price it takes

antti


Article: 103012
Subject: Re: I2C on Xilinx V4
From: christopher.saunter@durham.ac.uk (c d saunter)
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 18:50:42 +0000 (UTC)
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
Antti (Antti.Lukats@xilant.com) wrote:
: it depends, :) microblaze is true overkill, but picoblaze isnt,
: specially if you have some other minor managements taks to take also,
: then it really pays the fpga resource price it takes

Also if the 'I2C' device isn't following the spec particularly well then 
debugging the interface by reloading the picoblaze ROM at run time makes 
for a much better interactive debugging experience than recompiling VHDL!

Of course this isn't relevant as nobody would ever ship a device with a 
broken I2C compatible interface...

cds

Article: 103013
Subject: Re: Verilog vs VHDL
From: ptkwt@aracnet.com (Phil Tomson)
Date: 24 May 2006 19:04:21 GMT
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
In article <1148420806.519398.325680@u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com>,
Kishore <kishore2k4@gmail.com> wrote:
>Hi,
>
>     I know this has been brought up many times in various groups but
>here is my view on them and I would really appreciate some
>clarification. I started working on FPGA design and stuff some 3 months
>back or so. All the time I was switching back and forth between verilog
>and VHDL for various projects. I personally feel that one can be very
>productive as in time with Verilog? I only use VHDL if there is no
>choice but I am not aganist VHDL or anything.
>
>     After some searching on google and various usenet groups I came
>across many arguments regarding Verilog vs VHDL  summarising either as
>"use the right the tool for the right job" or "leading to language
>wars". I am open-minded and I am biased to the former at the same time
>a bit biased to verilog :) I just wanted to know some things.
>
>-> Are there things that VHDL does better than verilog or vice-versa
>-> What is the most widely used language in the industry i.e. FPGA and
>ASIC designs. I think VHDL is the dominant one as Xilinx totally uses
>VHDL?
>
>   All kinds of thoughts, experiences and constructive criticisms will
>be helpful.


Here be dragons and I should perhaps not jump into the dragon pit, but 
here's an observation:

One thing I notice is that people who have had exposure to software 
development seem to prefer VHDL because VHDL allows one to define new 
types whereas with Verilog you've gotta be happy with the types that come 
with it out-of-the-box.  Hardware engineers with lots of software 
background might therefore tend to prefer VHDL whereas Hardware engineers 
with less software development experience might tend to prefer Verilog 
because they may not care about the potential benefits of being able to  
define new types.

...but I don't want to over generalize... ;-)

Phil

Article: 103014
Subject: Re: FPGA delay generator
From: Kolja Sulimma <news@sulimma.de>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 21:14:17 +0200
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
John Adair schrieb:
> I don't understand where the there are issues of jitter unless you use a DCM 
> in which case you will have issues with all Xilinx FPGAs and to varying 
> extent other vendors too. The point of our board is that you can have a high 
> speed clock with low jitter and not necessarily using the DCM which does 
> have jitter of some 10s of picoseconds. 

Even with a zero jitter 1GHz clock the generated delay will jitter 1ns.
The output will arrive anytime in a clock period, but the output will be
generated a fixed time after a clock edge. The delay is the difference
between input and output. It will have +-500ps error.

The 50ps jitter in the DG535 spec really means that the delay is fixed
with 50ps accuracy, not only that the output time can be predicted with
50ps accuracy.

Kolja Sulimma



Article: 103015
Subject: Re: PCI 64/66 fpga eval boards
From: pbdelete@spamnuke.ludd.luthdelete.se.invalid
Date: 24 May 2006 19:15:10 GMT
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
In sci.electronics.design mljohnson00@yahoo.com wrote:
>Hi Sanjay,

>I'm afraid I can't answer your question directly, but I can offer some
>food for thought. Be very careful treading into 64/66 PCI territory.
>The technology is new(ish), somewhat unproven, and mostly untested.
>I've had experience with board vendors that flat out lie about the
>64/66 capability of the boards or at least they never bothered to test
>to see if it really worked.

>Be sure you REALLY need that extra throughput. Good luck

Isn't PCI 64/66 a dead end considering PCI-express these days ?


Article: 103016
Subject: Re: Stopping Quartus using multipliers?
From: "Slurp" <slip@slop.slap>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 20:31:15 +0100
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>

"Nial Stewart" <nial@nialstewartdevelopments.co.uk> wrote in message 
news:4djilhF1annadU1@individual.net...
> I'm prototyping a design on an Altera NIOS evaluation board with
> an EP2C35. The design will eventually be targeted at a much smaller
> device, possibly an EP2C5.
>
> I have a couple of FIR filters that I want implemented in the FPGA
> fabric rather than in the dedicated multipliers so I can guage the
> footprint/performance. Quartus keeps using the multipliers and
> I can't work out how to stop it.
>
> Can anyone help?

In the multiplier megafunction (LPM_MULT) on page 2 there are switches 
available to turn off the use of the chips dedicated multipliers and use 
logic elements instead.

Slurp 



Article: 103017
Subject: Report for routing resource usage?
From: raarce@gmail.com
Date: 24 May 2006 12:32:30 -0700
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
Hello all:
Is there a way in Xilinx ISE of knowing the percentage of routing
resources that have been utilized after Place and Routing?  Until now I
was happy just knowing if a design was routable or not. Now I need to
have a more quantitive idea of the routing resource usage and I don't
know where to start looking. The default Place and Route report gives
only logic and I/O resource information.
Thanks,
Rafael Arce
University of Puerto Rico


Article: 103018
Subject: Re: Stopping Quartus using multipliers?
From: "Nial Stewart" <nial@nialstewartdevelopments.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 20:46:59 +0100
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
"Slurp" <slip@slop.slap> wrote in message 
news:4474b484$0$2661$ed2619ec@ptn-nntp-reader01.plus.net...

> In the multiplier megafunction (LPM_MULT) on page 2 there are switches available to turn off the 
> use of the chips dedicated multipliers and use logic elements instead.
> Slurp


I'm inferring the multipliers so don't have this control unfortunately.



Nial


----------------------------------------------------------
Nial Stewart Developments Ltd        Tel: +44 131 561 6291
42/2 Hardengreen Business Park       Fax: +44 131 561 6327
Dalkeith, Midlothian
EH22 3NU
www.nialstewartdevelopments.co.uk



Article: 103019
Subject: Re: Stopping Quartus using multipliers?
From: "Nial Stewart" <nial@nialstewartdevelopments.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 20:48:11 +0100
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
"Mike Treseler" <mike_treseler@comcast.net> wrote in message news:4djk48F1auig8U1@individual.net...
> Nial Stewart wrote:
>> I have a couple of FIR filters that I want implemented in the FPGA
>> fabric rather than in the dedicated multipliers so I can guage the
>> footprint/performance. Quartus keeps using the multipliers and
>> I can't work out how to stop it.
>
> Could you code something that uses up all the multipliers?
>     -- Mike Treseler


I suppose I could Mike, but it's a lot of hassle for what will hopefully
just be a switch/constraint.


Nial.



----------------------------------------------------------
Nial Stewart Developments Ltd        Tel: +44 131 561 6291
42/2 Hardengreen Business Park       Fax: +44 131 561 6327
Dalkeith, Midlothian
EH22 3NU
www.nialstewartdevelopments.co.uk



Article: 103020
Subject: Re: PCI 64/66 fpga eval boards
From: "John Aderseen" <John@nospam.com>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 21:56:59 +0200
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
Isn't ISA a dead end considering PCI, yet it is still used !!!!

<pbdelete@spamnuke.ludd.luthdelete.se.invalid> a écrit dans le message de 
news: 4474b0be$0$490$cc7c7865@news.luth.se...
> In sci.electronics.design mljohnson00@yahoo.com wrote:
>>Hi Sanjay,
>
>>I'm afraid I can't answer your question directly, but I can offer some
>>food for thought. Be very careful treading into 64/66 PCI territory.
>>The technology is new(ish), somewhat unproven, and mostly untested.
>>I've had experience with board vendors that flat out lie about the
>>64/66 capability of the boards or at least they never bothered to test
>>to see if it really worked.
>
>>Be sure you REALLY need that extra throughput. Good luck
>
> Isn't PCI 64/66 a dead end considering PCI-express these days ?
> 



Article: 103021
Subject: Re: Stopping Quartus using multipliers?
From: Henry Wong <henry@stuffedcow.net.nospam>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 16:03:03 -0400
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
> Quartus keeps using the multipliers and
> I can't work out how to stop it.
> 


How about setting

Analysis and Synthesis settings
-> More Settings
-> Maximum DSP Block Usage

to 0?  (Default -1)

Article: 103022
Subject: XdmHelpers:662
From: joel.weddick@lmco.com
Date: 24 May 2006 13:03:17 -0700
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
I am currently using ISE 8.1 and am receiving this message after
entering a clock period constraint:

WARNING:XdmHelpers:662 - Period specification "TS_U1_gen_clk1"
references the
   TNM group "U1/gen_clk1", which contains both pads and synchronous
elements.
   The timing analyzer will ignore the pads for this specification. You
might
   want to use a qualifier (e.g. "FFS") on the TNM property to remove
the pads
   from this group.

This clock (2 Khz) is generated using a counter and is internal to the
device.  What is the correct way to specify the qualifier so this
warning goes away?

Thanks,
Joel


Article: 103023
Subject: Re: PCI 64/66 fpga eval boards
From: Keith <krw@att.bizzzz>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 16:05:32 -0400
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
In article <4474ba59$0$294$7a628cd7@news.club-internet.fr>, 
John@nospam.com says...
> Isn't ISA a dead end considering PCI, yet it is still used !!!!
> 

ISA is still used because it's trivial to hack.  PCI is anything 
but.

-- 
  Keith

Article: 103024
Subject: Re: Stopping Quartus using multipliers?
From: "Nial Stewart" <nial@nialstewartdevelopments.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 21:17:06 +0100
Links: << >>  << T >>  << A >>
"Henry Wong" <henry@stuffedcow.net.nospam> wrote in message 
news:mvOdnZ8y7KReJunZnZ2dnUVZ_tSdnZ2d@teksavvy.com...
>> Quartus keeps using the multipliers and
>> I can't work out how to stop it.
> How about setting
>
> Analysis and Synthesis settings
> -> More Settings
> -> Maximum DSP Block Usage
>
> to 0?  (Default -1)


Thanks Henry, that did it.

I mistakenly presumed that -1 was a lower number than 0 and so
changing this to 0 wouldn't have made any difference.

Intuitive isn't it :-)


Nial


----------------------------------------------------------
Nial Stewart Developments Ltd        Tel: +44 131 561 6291
42/2 Hardengreen Business Park       Fax: +44 131 561 6327
Dalkeith, Midlothian
EH22 3NU
www.nialstewartdevelopments.co.uk





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